Violin Forum/Message Board

John Cadd · Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 7:32 am Post subject: oxygen and violin wood

Have any tests been done on violin wood (or completed violins) using a closed box containing 100% Oxygen to mimic 300 years of aging.The surface of wood is known to oxidise if left open to the air as this is said to affect gluing. Neat oxygen would push it to the limit,whatever that would be.
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Michael Darnton · Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 9:26 am Post subject:

Many makers have done things with oxidation to improve the look of wood--darkening it--but not with the idea of recreating any tonal effects of age.

The closest to what you're suggesting (some sort of gas fuming) was a brief infatuation with "ozone boxes": sealed boxes with a spark generator inside driven by a neon sign transformer (15,000 volts or so to throw a one inch spark). These give a nice look, but the resulting odixation destroys the structural integrity of the wood, leading to cracks, because it turns out the active ingredient, after a series of chemical changes, is nitric acid--a very strong oxidizer.

Some French makers did the same thing, using nitric acid directly, with the same results, and makers have also skipped the electricity, and fumed directly with nitric acid gas. Same results.

Given that 300 years of age undeniably results in oxidation and darkening, I wouldn't necessarily say oxidation is bad, but that type seems to be.

I don't know of anyone trying pure oxygen, though. The question would be whether that alone would accomplish anything. Or maybe it would do it in 150 years instead of 300? :-)

Mat Roop · Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 8:35 pm Post subject:

Are you sure it is oxidation?... could it be the off-gassing of the resins in the wood making things brighter with less "drag"? I don't know, but I would guess that has been tried using hi temperature for acceleration.
Let us know how your tests turn out!
Cheers, Mat

Michael Darnton · Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:02 pm Post subject:

Well, I think you're right about that, as well. There's certainly more than one thing going on. We can't discount 300 years of playing, either.

John Cadd · Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2009 11:48 am Post subject: oxygen

Some ideas are worth noting down as negative information.I was surprised that oxygen was not a good thing for violins or wood in general .This slow and gentle process I was thinking of would not be beneficial at all from what I read. [Nitric Acid---As far out on the edge as you could get] So that idea should stay on the negative board . I heard once that universities only record the ideas that are succesful which would leave elephant traps for the unwary.(I could be very wrong here)
I have heard of a maker who varnished as much as he could inside his instruments (not very thickly).Maybe he was pushing in the opposite direction or just stabilising or slowing down moisture movement. I always feel a shudder when I see a famous player dropping perspiration all over a precious instrument.