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ollieken
Super Member
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 281
Location: New Brunswick Canada
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 Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 11:13 am Post subject: Tail piece |
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How much effect on sound between old the tail Piece & the
new one with the fine tuners built in as long as you keep 55 mm or so
string length to the bridge is their much effect on sound ?
Just wondering as all the old fiddles did not have that kind of tail
piece . Ken |
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Mat Roop
Senior Member
Joined: 24 Mar 2007
Posts: 911
Location: Wyoming Ontario
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| Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 4:05 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Ken...
Here is what I think of fine tuners and afterlength... but weight is another matter and is also as important.
With the built in tuners, I don't think you will find much change (weight being the same). Before the advent of built in tuners, the problem used to be that the add-on fine tuners messed up the afterlength and hence the sound.
Now, a lot don't like the built in tuners, some because they are more susceptible to rattles, but good ones properly installed are not bad at all, and others don't like them because they are not traditional.
Thomastik recommend an afterlength of 57mm for their strings.
Here is a quote from M Darnton on Wikipedia "The shorter the afterlength, the tamer, more refined, more mellow and round the sound will be, but power and freedom of the instrument can suffer."
... and then there is more good info in MD's violin mag pg 34
http://www.darntonviolins.com/violinmagazine/book/setup.pdf
When it comes to weight, I weighed some old cheap ebony tailpieces and they were in the range of 11-13 grams. a newer ebony tailpiece weighed in at 16.9 grams and a new Wittner Ultra weighed in at 20.6gm... all without the tailwire.
Keep fiddlin Ken!... Cheers, Mat |
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ctviolin
Super Member
Joined: 07 May 2009
Posts: 961
Location: Roswell
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| Posted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:28 am Post subject: Re: Tail piece |
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| ollieken wrote: | How much effect on sound between old the tail Piece & the
new one with the fine tuners built in as long as you keep 55 mm or so
string length to the bridge is their much effect on sound ?
Just wondering as all the old fiddles did not have that kind of tail
piece . Ken |
I have an interesting story to tell here.
There are no strict laws about this type of thing. What works best, works best, and only trying it can really tell. There are no ways to tell exactly what works best with any "set-up" details, other than trying them.
So this is an odd occurrence, but absolutely true.
One time, I found that switching between an ebony tailpiece and putting on a metal one with fine tuners, made a very noticeable wolf note disappear, and disappear entirely...
The fact is that I have never noticed much difference between them, (or switching between them) so I would decide which type to use depending simply on who was getting the violin.
AND, I'll guess right now that the difference was incidental - not a practical thing that could be repeated. I simply found it interesting that a wolf may be dealt with by changing something like that.
A definite one time one incident. It could have easily been the other way around. But such odd things CAN HAPPEN when dealing with set up.
BTW - When I sold the violin, I told the woman who bought it (a friend) about not switching back to a wooden tailpiece...
_________________
Look,
Listen,
Learn. |
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ollieken
Super Member
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 281
Location: New Brunswick Canada
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| Posted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 11:19 am Post subject: Tail piece |
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Mat & Craig Thank you for the reply & the info from M Darnton
very interesting post.
BTW Craig that picture of your grandson is
precious & one to be to be proud of & (the Violin is nice too )
Tell him we are all proud of him on the violin forum
I have seen a lot of little ones learning at that age & a few years later they are amazing players . I don't know how they can keep up with school work music lessons step dancing & playing at night some do a lot of traveling as well .
Now I have seen some not only young people that want
to play without having to learn it & put the time & effort in doing so .
We are into a snow storm today we may get a foot or so Ken |
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Mat Roop
Senior Member
Joined: 24 Mar 2007
Posts: 911
Location: Wyoming Ontario
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| Posted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 5:30 pm Post subject: Re: Tail piece |
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| ollieken wrote: | | ...I have seen a lot of little ones learning at that age & a few years later they are amazing players . I don't know how they can keep up with school work music lessons step dancing & playing at night some do a lot of traveling as well .... Ken |
Interesting thought... when I started into this business in 1990, I used to go see a group call the Clay Creek fiddlers. every now and then I would see a young lad ... about the age of CT's grandson step up to the mike with a fiddle and start in with the band. His ball cap was half cocked to one side, and as he played he would be nodding to individuals in the audience and even chat with those that were within earshot. Amazing to me was that he did this in the middle of tunes and he never missed beat and that included the reels, hornpipes and whatever. The lead fiddler was actually my first client ( and my son's teacher) so I enquired as to how can a kid that young play so well and confidently. I was told that the other senior fiddler in the band was the young lads grandfather and when his daughter was pregnant with this lad, the grandfather would fiddle to his daughter most every night....the assumption by the family was that the music must have just rubbed off on him while in the womb. In time this lad became a Canadian fiddle Champ.
I guess no one fiddled to me in my mother's tummy!
Cheers, Mat |
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