Violin Forum/Message Board

Jack London · Junior Member Joined: 19 Dec 2007 Posts: 22

I have heard of using maybe a spoonful of lye to about a quart of tea as light stain/ grain figure enhancer. I have seen a friend use it, and there is a similar recipe is Weisshaar. From what I have seen, it works really well. I just can't bring myself to stain my wood with a lye solution, so until I find out otherwise, I won't do it.

Has anyone ever used this, or do you know someone who has, and do you know if the wood has held up?

L P Reedy · Posted: Mon Nov 01, 2010 6:35 pm Post subject:

I don't believe the lye has much to do with the staining. The tea does that. If the tea is acidic a pinch of lye might be OK but I wouldn't use a "spoonful" (tea- or table- ?).

I have soaked some samples in 10% lye but I don't remember why. I don't think it did what I was looking for. The maple got very flexible, temporarily, but after washing hardened again. I think the spruce was flexible across the grain. Anyway, there's nothing wrong with experimenting on samples but I wouldn't use it on a fiddle.

Michael Darnton · Posted: Mon Nov 01, 2010 10:10 pm Post subject:

I used it on a couple of violins. One I had to sell cheap, the other I eventually had to make a new top for. Over time, the lye works to turn the wood into something like cardboard. Not good. Same for ammonia, if you're tempted to use that.
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Jack London · Junior Member Joined: 19 Dec 2007 Posts: 22

Thanks for the info. I just needed to hear it from someone with experience. Michael, do you know if makers have been doing this a while? Perhaps this is something from the furniture industry?

By the way, it is much more effective than tea alone--- I have done both on test pieces. I dont know what happens, but the lye does something to the figure that makes it pop without a burn. Probably good for gun stocks....

Michael Darnton · Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:17 pm Post subject:

I know that some makers have done these things. Think about it, furniture is an inch thick and doesn't have to support strings. Violins are a couple of mm thick and have 70 pounds of string tension. It doesn't take much to ruin a violin.
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actonern · Super Member Joined: 15 Aug 2007 Posts: 444

Hi Michael:

Does your caution include fuming with amonia?

Best regards,

Ernie

Michael Darnton · Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:42 pm Post subject:

It does, yes. A lot of people use it; other's have proved it causes damage. Take your choice.
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fyoder · Junior Member Joined: 05 Aug 2010 Posts: 9

Does a tea stain alone, being acidic, also cause damage over time? Is there a way to neutralize the acid without diminishing the effect?

Michael Darnton · Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 7:29 pm Post subject:

I wouldn't worry about tea. Tannic acid doesn't attack wood, and there's not much of it in tea, anyway.
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fyoder · Junior Member Joined: 05 Aug 2010 Posts: 9

rs · Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 12:37 am Post subject:

Michael, I have in the past been a believer in letting only the varnish supply the color. Occasionally I tanned the instrument in the sun, but that was about it. This past year, however, I have a client who has a beautiful (and I mean a beauty) Vuillaume (I also have raised my opinion about Vuillaume dramatically after seeing this instrument) that has very pronounced curl that appears to be highlighted and she requests I duplicate it. Some appears to be through age and wear, but some of the original varnish is present and underneath the curl is VERY dramatic, much more than any I have seen or would be possible to create through varnish alone. I never have liked tea or stain as they appear "fake" to me personally. Any suggestions? Thank you.

Also, Jack, I have used lye quite a bit on color for varnish, but never used lye on wood. I had a similar bad experience when I made a batch of red varnish with excessive lye and it ate the varnish about 6 months after it was done. I had a major rework to do. What I did to remedy in the future was mix the lye with the color to get the intensity I wanted and then added alum to neutralize the solution before I applied it to the varnish. I found if I added about the same amount of alum as I had already added in lye, the color was no longer alkaline, nor was it enough alum to form precipitates. This seemed to solve my problem. Not sure if it will help in your question though.

All the best.
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