Violin Forum/Message Board

[John Cadd]

One youtube site thinking to help players struggling to keep their violins in tune has advocated slackening the strings and re - winding the string tight up against the peg box to keep the peg from slipping . Most of the Many Comments were completely in agreement with such a bad practice . It seems the time has come to fit small individual guitar tuners to get around the problem . Frustration with slipping pegs is driving budding new players away from violins .
I fitted a set on my skeleton violin and found the tiny conversion very easy .

[fionasimpson1475]

Slacking the strings and re-winding against the peg box is a risky fix that can cause more issues in the long run. Peg slipping is frustrating, but fitting small guitar tuners is a great solution! I’ve had success with this on my own violin, and it makes tuning much easier for beginners and seasoned players alike.
hills of steel

[John Cadd]

I found the smallest single string tuners needed very tiny bits of filing to allow the ends of the metal pegs to come through the box . I imagine there might be lighter ones to do the job . The cosmetic gears that look like traditional pegs are pretty expensive and they impinge more on the peg hole surfaces . It`s possible to get them the wrong way round too . Two left and two right . The guitar ones just need pairs of small screws.Any climate changes are not a problem .Players in the middle of nowhere can still get their regular practice .
One cure for slipping pegs I saw recently was Plasticene . The usual peg compound I used may go a bit too hard over time. I don`t find it easy to use . I`ve just rebushed a set of pegs that were out of line . The A string was pressing on the E peg .This was on an old German violin where other short cuts had been made.

[John Cadd]

To focus on the people advocating the string jamming methods I might as well state who they are : Kennedy Violins . I doubt if Nigel would recommend the peg slipping solution .I don`t know if Nigel Kennedy has any connection with the firm .
The string jamming was also recommended on Violinist .com at one time .Shame on you .
Peg jamming ,especially with metal wound strings would damage the strings ,also the pegs and also the pegbox .
But guitar pegs will add some weight and need tiny screws to fix them . It`s a fair balance .

[allscabo]

I agree that using peg jamming methods can cause more harm than good, especially with metal-wound strings. Over time, it can damage the strings and affect the pegbox as well.

[Michael Darnton]

https://pegheds.com/
I've installed quite a few sets of these for students and they work great. When I tell professionals, who depend on being able to instantly change a string on stage during a concert how many turns it takes to change a string it's a big "nope".
_________________
new blog at my site! http://darntonviolins.com/blog
my work sites: http://darntonviolins.com and http://darntonhersh.com

[John Cadd]

I always thought that violin bushings were made of Maple but today the advertise boxwood bushings . How do they react ? Are they better than Maple .
Why did the professionals and peg turns give a big Nope ? I missed the meaning of that . What was the problem ?

[Michael Darnton]

With normal pegs you can change a string in about 30 seconds. With geared pegs it takes a couple of minutes. If you're the only violin in a group on stage with an audience waiting that's a big difference.

Boxwood is used for bushings because it's a nice color and has no character--just a flat non-reflective tan color. In retouching you can paint on whatever you need to have to match the wood around it and make the bushing almost disappear.
_________________
new blog at my site! http://darntonviolins.com/blog
my work sites: http://darntonviolins.com and http://darntonhersh.com

[John Cadd]

Oh I get it .I had to look up Nope to see if the professionals were being rude to you . So they need to carry a motorised peg turner for the job . I`m sure some tat from Temu would keep them happy .
I mentioned boxwood bushings as it seems just as slippery as pegs . I tried plasticene and that slows down the fast unwinding tendency,That must get into the maple wood grain. It still feels like an odd idea .Chalk went out of fashion. The peg dope is another nuisance. It keeps jumping back out of sight .It must all seem such a damn nuisance to new players . That`s the perspective that will work best .To understand newcomers .

[John Cadd]

Some interesting meaurements to compare wooden pegs with tailpiece adjusters --and guitar tuners
weight of 4 wooden pegs =16,5 grams
4 guitar tuners =18.1 grams
That`s a difference of 1.6 grams . The same weight as a tail pin.
4 tailpiece adjusters=25.2grams.
Tailpiece adjusters need resetting as the string stretches. That applies to built in tailpiece adjusters.
Some Perfection /Kniling pegs are tapered but they say there is no force to make them slip. That cannot be true so they must use glue .
So geared Violin pegs cost between £70 to £100 .
Guitar pegs --a set of 6 cost only £7.93 per set .
The only extra weight at the scroll is 1.6 grams .(One end pin) .Don`t forget the tiny fixing screws .
The guitar tuner machines (that`s what they call them) have plastic sleeves on the rollers .They can be pulled off to leave the metal rollers .That means no carpentry is needed to fit in the peg hole slots. If players like gut strings the traditional pegs were used a lot to keep them in tune . The guitar tuners will make gut strings more usable .That`s a little paradox .Old and new together .

[John Cadd]

I asked one of the geared peg makers about the weight of 4 peg tuners .
Here is the ominous news . 46 grams .
I always assumed the downside of guitar style tuners at the scroll would be the tone killer for a violin. It`s not that crucial but certainly guitar tuners will not have any negative effect on violin tone.
School violin teachers trying to run an orchestra where humidity goes up and down like a fiddlers`s elbow can see these guitar tuners as a big relief . Weigh that up against appearance. How about lightweight stick on imitation pegs that stick out sideways disguising what is really doing the work .

[Michael Darnton]

Always question assumptions.
_________________
new blog at my site! http://darntonviolins.com/blog
my work sites: http://darntonviolins.com and http://darntonhersh.com

[John Cadd]

I had not thought about Double Bass tuners but they are well established already . The pegs point down instead of sideways.Visually you can think of them like a cat with it`s ears pulled back ready for a fight .There`s another cat meme about violins for you .